Steve Rayhawk’s Breakdown of Factors Involved in the Findings of the AAAS Panel on “Long-Term AI Futures” Tuesday, Dec 15 2009
In February 2009, the President of the American Association for Artificial Intelligence, Eric Horvitz, convened a panel on “long-term AI futures” which explicitly delved into issues around the Singularity and intelligence explosion. Horvitz has told me (and the New York Times) that the reason he convened the panel was not due to personal interest or concern in the issue but in response to the public interest and concern in the issue.
In the New York Times article covering the meeting, Horvitz was quoted as saying, “My sense was that sooner or later we would have to make some sort of statement or assessment, given the rising voice of the technorati and people very concerned about the rise of intelligent machines”. In August, they released an interim report that said:
Popular perspectives on the outcomes of AI research include expectation that there will be one or more disruptive outcomes. These include that notion that the research will somehow lead to the advent of utopia or catastrophe. The utopian perspective is perhaps best captured in the writings of Ray Kurzweil and others, who speak of a forthcoming “technological singularity.” At the other end of the spectrum, some people are concerned about the “rise of intelligent machines,” fueled by popular novels and movies, that tell stories of the loss of control of robots. Whether forecasting utopian or catastrophic outcomes, the radical perspectives are frightening to people in that they highlight some form of radical change on the horizon—often founded on a notion of the loss of control of the computational intelligences that we create.
The panel of experts was overall skeptical of the radical views expressed by futurists and science-fiction authors.
To me, this was a disappointing result. The phrasing is also disappointing. It is not just the opinion of “popular perspectives” that AI will “somehow” lead to the advent of utopia or catastrophe. Many academics (including AI researchers) have presented views that AI would be highly disruptive, including Ray Solomonoff, Nick Bostrom, Shane Legg, Matt Mahoney, I.J. Good, Bill Gates, Hans Moravec, Marvin Minsky, and many others. Solomonoff, Moravec, and Minsky have all been leaders in AI for decades, so it seems like a deliberate choice of focus to attribute “radical views” to the public rather than AI experts. It provides the AAAS panel with a comfortable level of removal from the claims, a level of removal they could not easily obtain if they cited Solomonoff, Moravec, and Minsky as the sources of Singularity views.
It is remarkable for the panel to suggest that AI will probably not result in disruptive outcomes — if you can turn a pile of sand into a thinking intelligence in the time it takes you to fabricate a computer chip and transfer files to it, then that wouldn’t be disruptive? In my view, it is the degree of disruption that is up for debate — I don’t take people very seriously if they imply there will be little or no disruption whatsoever.
In wondering why the panel came up with this result, Eliezer Yudkowsky suggested “snap consideration and snap judgment”. However, Steve Rayhawk offered a more detailed analysis, which I will post in its entirety here, with a few formatting changes to ensure successful reposting. The first two sentences are a quote that Rayhawk is responding to. Everything that follows from this point on (except for the last line and the quote) was posted by Steve Rayhawk to Less Wrong.
Roughly, what I expect to happen by default is no modular analysis at all - just snap consideration and snap judgment. I feel little need to explain such.
You, or somebody anyway, could still offer a modular causal model of that snap consideration and snap judgment. For example:
1. What cached models of the planning abilities of future machine intelligences did the academics have available when they made the snap judgment?
1.1 What fraction of the academics are aware of any current published AI architectures which could reliably reason over plans at the level of abstraction of “implement a proxy intelligence”?
1.1.1 What fraction of them have thought carefully about when there might be future practical AI architectures that could do this?
1.1.2 What fraction use a process for answering questions about the category distinctions that will be known in the future, which uses as an unconscious default the category distinctions known in the present?
2. What false claims have been made about AI in the past? What decision rules might academics have learned to use, to protect themselves from losing prestige for being associated with false claims like those?
2.1 How much do those decision rules refer to modular causal analyses of the object of a claim and of the fact that people are making the claim?
2.2 How much do those decision rules refer to intuitions about other peoples’ states of mind and social category memberships?
2.3 How much do those decision rules refer to intuitions about other peoples’ intuitive decision rules?
2.4 Historically, have peoples’ own abilities to do modular causal analyses been good enough to make them reliably safe from losing prestige by being associated with false claims? What fraction of academics have the intuitive impression that their own ability to do analysis isn’t good enough to make them reliably safe from losing prestige by association with a false claim, so that they can only be safe if they use intuitions about the states of mind and social category memberships of a claim’s proponents?
3. Of those AI academics who believe that a machine intelligence could exist which could outmaneuver humans if motivated, how do they think about the possible motivations of a machine intelligence?
3.1 What fraction of them think about AI design in terms of a formalism such as approximating optimal sequential decision theory under a utility function? How easy would it be for them to substitute anthropomorphic intuitions for correct technical predictions?
3.2 What fraction of them think about AI design in terms of intuitively justified decision heuristics? How easy would it be for them to substitute anthropomorphic intuitions for correct technical predictions?
3.3 What fraction of them understand enough evolutionary psychology and/or cognitive psychology to recognize moral evaluations as algorithmically caused, so that they can reject the default intuitive explanation of the cause of moral evaluations, which seems to be: “there are intrinsic moral qualities attached to objects in the world, and when any intelligent agent apprehends an object with a moral quality, the action of the moral quality on the agent’s intelligence is to cause the agent to experience a moral evaluation”?
3.3.1 What combination of specializations in AI, moral philosophy, and cognitive psychology would an academic need to have, to be an “expert” whose disagreements about the material causes and implementation of moral evaluations were significant?
4. On the question of takeoff speeds, what fraction of the AI academics have a good enough intuitive understanding of decision theory to see that a point estimate or default scenario should not be substituted for a marginal posterior distribution, even in a situation where it would be socially costly in the default scenario to take actions which prevent large losses in one tail of the distribution?
4.1 What fraction recognized that they had a prior belief distribution over possible takeoff speeds at all?
4.2 What fraction understood that, regarding a variable which is underconstrained by evidence, “other people would disapprove of my belief distribution about this variable” is not an indicator for “my belief distribution about this variable puts mass in the wrong places”, except insofar as there is some causal reason to expect that disapproval would be somehow correlated with falsehood?
5 What other popular concerns have academics historically needed to dismiss? What decision rules have they learned to decide whether they need to dismiss a current popular concern?
5.1 After they make a decision to dismiss a popular concern, what kinds of causal explanations of the existence of that concern do they make reference to, when arguing to other people that they should agree with the decision?
5.2 How much do the true decision rules depend on those causal explanations?
5.3 How much do the decision rules depend on intuitions about the concerned peoples’ states of mind and social category memberships?
5.4 How much do the causal explanations use concepts which are implicitly defined by reference to hidden intuitions about states of mind and social category memberships?
5.4.1 Can these intuitively defined concepts carry the full weight of the causal explanations they are used to support, or does their power to cause agreement come from their ability to activate social intuitions?
6. Which people are the AI academics aware of, who have argued that intelligence explosion is a concern? What social categories do they intuit those people to be members of? What arguments are they aware of? What states of mind do they intuit those arguments to be indicators of (e.g. as in intuitively computed separating equilibria)?
6.1 What people and arguments did the AI academics think the other AI academics were thinking of? If only a few of the academics were thinking of people and arguments who they intuited to come from credible social categories and rational states of mind, would they have been able to communicate this to the others?
7. When the AI academics made the decision to dismiss concern about an intelligence explosion, what kinds of causal explanations of the existence of that concern did they intuitively expect that they would be able make reference to, if they later had to argue to other people that they should agree with the decision?
It is also possible to model the social process in the panel:
8. Are there factors that might make a joint statement by a panel of AI academics reflect different conclusions than they would have individually reached if they had been outsiders to the AI profession with the same AI expertise?
8.1 One salient consideration would be that agreeing with popular concern about an intelligence explosion would result in their funding being cut. What effects would this have had?
8.1.1 Would it have affected the order in which they became consciously aware of lines of argument that might make an intelligence explosion seem less or more deserving of concern?
8.1.2 Would it have made them associate concern about an intelligence explosion with unpopularity? In doubtful situations, unpopularity of an argument is one cue for its unjustifiability. Would they associate unpopularity with logical unjustifiability, and then lose willingness to support logically justifiable lines of argument that made an intelligence explosion seem deserving of concern, just as if they had felt those lines of argument to be logically unjustifiable, but without any actual unjustifiability?
8.2 There are social norms to justify taking prestige away from people who push a claim that an argument is justifiable while knowing that other prestigious people think the argument to to be a marker of a non-credible social category or state of mind. How would this have affected the discussion?
8.3 If there were panelists who personally thought the intelligence explosion argument was plausible, and they were in the minority, would the authors of the panel’s report mention it?
8.3.1 Would the authors know about it?
8.3.2 If the authors knew about it, would they feel any justification or need to mention those opinions in the report, given that the other panelists may have imposed on the authors an implicit social obligation to not write a report that would “unfairly” associate them with anything they think will cause them to lose prestige?
8.3.3 If panelists in such a minority knew that the report would not mention their opinions, would they feel any need or justification to object, given the existence of that same implicit social obligation?
9. How good are groups of people at making judgments about arguments that unprecedented things will have grave consequences?
9.1 How common is a reflective, causal understanding of the intuitions people use when judging popular concerns and arguments about unprecedented things, of the sort that would be needed to compute conditional probabilities like “Pr( we would decide that concern is not justified | we made our decision according to intuition X ∧ concern was justified )”?
9.2 How common is the ability to communicate the epistemic implications of that understanding in real-time while a discussion is happening, to keep it from going wrong?
A great breakdown, worth thinking carefully about.

December 15th, 2009 at 3:42 pm
My theory about the forming of the AAAI panel is as follows:
DOOM peddlers gather funding from hapless innocents to help them SAVE THE WORLD - while the academics see them as bringing their field into disrepute, by unjustifiably linking their field to existential risk, with their irresponsible scaremongering about THE END OF THE WORLD AS WE KNOW IT.
Naturally, the academics sense a potential threat to their own funding - and so write papers to reassure the public that spending taxpayer’s money on this stuff is Really Not As Bad As All That.
December 15th, 2009 at 4:36 pm
Re: I don’t take people very seriously if they imply there will be little or no disruption whatsoever.
Much depends on what you mean by “disruptive”.
For example, if we have the future being managed by a powerful world government, that controls practically everything, then there might be relatively few power outages and little terrorism. Civilisation might well become pretty stable - and become relatively unaffected by “disruptions”.
December 15th, 2009 at 5:13 pm
But Tim, whether or not you dismiss or respect a given threat depends on the information you have about it and what arguments you’ve been exposed to. Isn’t it more plausible to assume the Occam’s razor conclusion — that we simply have different data — than that we are deliberately doom-enthusiast scaremongers, especially given that we started off in 2000 believing that the probability of doom was negligible, but changed our views based on new scientific arguments (rather than social rallying)?
December 16th, 2009 at 12:41 am
I must admit that the statement from AAAI doesn’t surprise me.
Also attributing the radical views to the public rather than the experts seems more like a tribute to the facts to me, than something based on any kind of ill will. The most radical views come from half informed semi-professionals. Those are the ones that lead to the term “rapture of the nerds”, not the musings of respected researchers about the future of their field.
Furthermore the statement doesn’t even say that AI will not be disruptive to the future.
“Popular perspectives on the outcomes of AI research include expectation that there will be one or more disruptive outcomes.”
I doubt that anybody can argue about the disruption of human culture by a self improving AI in a hard takeoff scenario. But the “outcomes of AI research” might just not provide the means to that end within a reasonably short timescale, which seems to be implied here.
In order to cite one of the most wonderful groups in the US, who have given me unending hours of “high quality entertainment” recently: Teach the controversy!
It might only be my imagination, limited data set, or bias, but it seems to me that the proponents of “the Singularity” seem to almost exclusively share the classical underpinnings of GOFAI, the Good OldFashioned AI as a high level algorithmic process. As soon as you vary the underlying assumptions and venture out toward embodied AI, dynamical systems-approaches or the more directly brain-based neuronal architectures, the general consensus (if there even was one in the first place) about the probability or even the possibility of AGI decreases substantially.
If this disagreement really is about different sets of data that begs the question:
Do they know something you don’t, or do you know something they don’t?
December 16th, 2009 at 1:29 am
An AI professor explicitly told me that he thinks that singularity risks should be downplayed because if AI risk gets taken seriously, his funding would be at risk.
December 16th, 2009 at 6:12 pm
Tim: I’ve followed your posts for a while. You and I are in agreement that the SIAI group tends to underestimate collective intelligence, and overestimates the chances of a hard ascent.
Wollff: You wrote a very good comment. Few people are realistically working on neural type hardware. Jeff Hawkins is trying to model the neocortex, and even his implementations are software emulations running on general purpose processors. But, I don’t understand your comment that, as you study realistic brain models, you’ll conclude that AI is, or approaches, impossibility. The Turing Thesis holds that any hardware, or biological implementation, can ultimately be emulated as software on a general purpose computer, (ie GOFAI). So it seems that GOFAI is possible, but you can’t just get there by hand coding, you’ve got to study real brains. Even after you get AI, more parallel hardware architecture is necessary if it is to run at any realistic speed.
December 17th, 2009 at 4:00 am
Well if I were an AI academic (I’m not) I’d seek to downplay science fictional “takeover” scenarios because those would have little or nothing to do with AI in the present or foreseeable future. Public belief in such scenarios would be likely only to harm my profession by generating unrealistic expectations. If new people were to enter the academic arena believing that superintelligence is just around the corner, and then be confronted by the actual state of the art which is far more mundane, there might be a high dropout rate which ultimately affects both university income as a whole and likely income and prestige for my own department. I would be extremely reticent to make speculations about AIs decades into the future, because we have very little idea what such systems will be like. There are no existing working systems (proto-AGIs) which I could analyse the behavior of to make an informed (as opposed to fantasy based) prediction. Also simple probability based models of the future are likely to be uninformative, due to the discontinuous nature of technological development which introduce unknown unknowns.
As a scientist I would also be cautious about sounding too confident that I know exactly what will happen to AI in the future. My knowledge about any subject - even my own specialist one - is limited, potentially subject to erroneous assumptions and in constant flux.
However, if I was not an academic but still wanted to make an income based in some way around AI I might be tempted to adopt a contrary strategy. If I thought it was likely that there would be few personal consequences for myself I might become a megaphone diplomat loudly proselytizing imminent catastrophe at the hands of runaway AI technologies. There’s no doubt that doom and alarmism sells (check out any old-fashioned tabloid newspaper or popular TV shows), and can be used to support a comfortable career selling books or other kinds of media.
The real future of AI is likely to be more complex either than the populists/catastrophists or the academics/conservatives claim. It’s just very hard to predict.
December 17th, 2009 at 2:13 pm
Gus:
You are right, the Turing-thesis makes AI possible. Strictly speaking only people rejecting either the implications of physicalism or the Turing-thesis can realistically claim the impossibility of an AI on theoretical grounds, which shifts this viewpoint towards the fringe. Nobody worth his/her salt in the sciences of the mind rejects either of them nowadays (though I’m always happy to be proven wrong, should I have overlooked someone).
So when talking about the impossibility of an AI people mostly refer to practical impossibility. Depending on the “school” the people belong to, there are several arguments you hear about the reasons for the impossibility of an AI in practice. One can arrange them in concentric circles (freely after Varela), with the people believing in the realistic possibility of an AGI within a reasonably short time in the center.
Right there in the middle would be the “algorithmic AI” school in the sense of a general problem solver: “AI is essentially algorithmic, we just need to find the right one. We haven’t found it yet, because it’s a little more complex than we first thought (in the 50’s), but we are on our way. Just give us 10 more years…”
The next circle are the neuronal people, who basically say that you either have to at least look at neurons, or even at the brain, to understand intelligence and you have to subsequently build it at that level. That would correspond to your argument that building an AI would require a deeper understanding of the brain and more parallel hardware in order to be feasible and that one won’t find the “intelligence algorithm” by poking around at the level of reasoning. Here you hear things like: “Yes AI is possible, but before we can talk about that we have to admit that this brain thing is damned complex and we will need parallel hardware, so give us another 20, then we’ll give you a brain in a jar…”
As a sidenote: in this group you have the greatest variety of opinions about AI, since there are many views concerning the level of detail necessary.
Next circle would be the dynamical systems and embodiment people who say that a brain in a jar won’t be enough. They regard intelligence as deeply rooted in the physical properties of an intelligent system and its interactions with the environment. Their view would be like: “Well, if we want intelligence we’ll have to base our abstractions on the systemic interaction of the system with its environment, including a rich range of feedback interactions taking place not only inside the brain, but between inside and outside. We don’t have the math to do that in depth yet, but wait another 10 years and we’ll have a full-fledged field of study there… Oh and since all of that might be critically dependent on something as close as possible to an analog mode of computation… when will your quantum computer be ready?”
To conclude this post (which again is much too long… sorry):
There are people thinking that for an AI we just need some more computing power and the right algorithms.
There are people out there who think that for an AI we need new hardware, much more computing power, (maybe) a new set of algorithms and a whole lot more knowledge about the inner workings of the brain.
There are people out there who think that for an AI we need quite a bit of new math, ridiculously advanced hardware and computing power as well as a more or less complete understanding of the brain on a level we are just dabbling in right now.
That’s the reason why in group two and three there are quite a few people who find it practical to regard AI as impossible within a reasonably short timespan.
December 17th, 2009 at 5:49 pm
Wolfgang Pauli:
Thank you for your post. I learned quite a bit from it. If you don’t mind my asking, which ring of the concentric circle do you believe is correct?
Also, what do you think of the hard ascent scenario?
December 19th, 2009 at 1:57 pm
Academic funding problems as a result of AI fears have happened before:
“It was rumoured in some of the UK national press of the time that Margaret Thatcher watched Professor Fredkin being interviewed on a late night TV science programme. Fredkin explained that superintelligent machines were destined to surpass the human race in intelligence quite soon, and that if we were lucky they might find human beings interesting enough to keep us around as pets. The rumour is that Margaret Thatcher decided that the “artificial intelligentsia” whom she was just proposing to give lots of research funds under the Alvey Initiative were seriously deranged.”
- http://www.dai.ed.ac.uk/homes/cam/Robots_Wont_Rule2.shtml#Bad
December 19th, 2009 at 4:54 pm
Using the term “deliberately” makes it sound as though I am attributing malicious intent. That isn’t what I intended to convey. I am sure that the DOOM purveyors really believe that DOOM is imminent. That is why they think alerting others to the imminent threat of DOOM is so important.
Some probability of DOOM is reasonable and sensible. Humans probably vary in whether they systematically over or under estimate risks (paranoia and fearlessness). The paranoid will over-estimate the probability - and it is those people who make most of the noise about the topic. They form a self-selected group who go to conferences on the topic together, cite each others results, and develop financial interests in the area - book sales, fundraising efforts, etc.
December 20th, 2009 at 6:33 pm
Gus:
To make it short, I’m standing on the outer fringe of the second circle.
So I basically think that the interesting things happen on a neuronal level in the brain and that the creation of an AI that deserves the name might be dependent on computing power as much as an understanding of the mechanisms that are at work there.
As far as the hard ascent scenarios I’m still skeptical. It’s true, if something like that happens the consequences will be huge.
But we know too little in order to justify the belief that it will happen.
It might boil down to a question about the nature of intelligence: If it is something like an absolute quantity that you can increase without great problems (a linear function of computational power), hard takeoff is likely. If it is something, where every “point of IQ” an AI gains, can only be reached by solving exponentially more difficult problems every step of the way, it might not turn out to be such a hard takeoff after all.
I am not a professional AI person, but from my point of view it looks like the second case seems to reflect the current situation more accurately. Even with the help of Moore’s Law as leverage, AI as a field seems to be fighting an uphill battle, with every point gained, facing a more difficult problem ahead.
I have to admit that I might be on shaky ground here, but at least it should be easy to see the roots of my opinions on the “hard takeoff” scenario.